tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post5993520126642380363..comments2023-10-03T11:41:21.191+01:00Comments on The Truth About Lies: The art and science of reading poetry out loud (with Stephen Hawking)Jim Murdochhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12786388638146471193noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-73583331620308692042008-08-12T22:48:00.000+01:002008-08-12T22:48:00.000+01:00Poor concentration, Rachel? I don't think that's i...Poor concentration, <B>Rachel</B>? I don't think that's it. I just don't think poetry works poem after poem after poem. I find it hard to read poems like that let alone listen to them. I normally read one or two at a time. That's where the Internet is good because I <I>can</I> do that and take time over my reading. I think poems need time and that's one thing I hate about readings, you get one shot and then it's done.Jim Murdochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12786388638146471193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-26914371808545625422008-08-12T21:12:00.000+01:002008-08-12T21:12:00.000+01:00I do kind of know what you mean - there are certai...I do kind of know what you mean - there are certainly some poems (by other poets) that I like to read quietly to myself in my head and I have no desire to hear them read aloud. Also, whilst I do really enjoy reading/performing myself, I am not a poetry reading junkie or anything. I go to readings by other poets quite rarely and cannot do this go-to-a-festival-and-see/hear-poet-after-poet-after-poet.<BR/>I have tried and it gives me a HUGE headache. For me I can only take in a couple of readings-type events at a time or my brain starts to blur and frazzle. In the same way I like it when poets only read a few poems per reading really - if they read and read and read without much of a break I just stop taking it in. Poor concentration? Maybe. Or maybe I'm still thinking about the first or second poem and they're onto the tenth. Personally I talk, sing, waffle....between poems quite a bit so they don't just come at you bam, bam, bam.Rachel Foxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11803852725693518924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-42802987054618074712008-08-11T18:08:00.000+01:002008-08-11T18:08:00.000+01:00I have little doubt, Rachel, that I would be able ...I have little doubt, <B>Rachel</B>, that I would be able to read my poems before an audience with little trouble - I'm a more than competent public speaker - but the thing is I never wrote my poems <I>to</I> be read aloud. That they could be is academic. They could be folded up into paper planes and chucked out the window. Reading a poem you gain the auditory experience but you lose the visual one unless the audience is sitting with a copy of the poem in front of them which is unlikely. I've always viewed reading a poem as a solitary thing, private and I'm not sure how that would work with a load of people around me. Listening to someone read I'd be forced to contend with their choices of pitch, pace and power and I'm not sure I care too much for that.Jim Murdochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12786388638146471193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-48588258443769090832008-08-11T15:58:00.000+01:002008-08-11T15:58:00.000+01:00Coming to this one very late...just came via your ...Coming to this one very late...just came via your link.<BR/><BR/>I think it is as simple as some poets like reading their poems out to an audience and do it well...some don't. It doesn't mean they have to be a particular type of poet necessarily (I have heard some very good, very serious poems read aloud very well as well as good, funny pieces).<BR/><BR/>I have watched and heard some poets who do not do their poems any favours by reading or performing them and I have heard others who do a great job - bring the poems to life, engage the audience, make them think/laugh/cry, make people want to buy the book... Personally I love reading my poems to an audience but I don't call it performing (although I suppose there is a hint of performance to it...) and even though some of the poems have humour in them I don't think of myself as a comedian (Jeez the pressure to be funny..couldn't bear that!). I don't expect every poet to enjoy that side of things but I do...but then there are other parts of the 'job' I like less (magazine submissions, competitions, writing groups to name but a few). We all have our strengths and weaknesses!<BR/><BR/>The love child of Pam Ayres and JCC now there's a subject for a poem.Rachel Foxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11803852725693518924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-55949669262158372142008-03-13T18:27:00.000+00:002008-03-13T18:27:00.000+00:00I have to say, Glenn, I sometimes regret not livin...I have to say, Glenn, I sometimes regret not living in San Francisco – it reminded me a lot of Glasgow when I was there, only drier. The only problem, me being me, is that I'd still probably not go, misanthropic so-and-so that I am.Jim Murdochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12786388638146471193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-49389681580601057012008-03-13T16:48:00.000+00:002008-03-13T16:48:00.000+00:00I have been to many poetry readings. They are freq...I have been to many poetry readings. They are frequently painful. Most poets couldn't bring a poem to life to save their own -- and out in the audience, man, you feel like you're dying. <BR/><BR/>On the other hand, yes, a poetry reading can be wonderful. I help run a reading series in San Francisco and last week we had two readers who were just excellent -- the writing was good, the performance was good. It just felt right. <BR/><BR/>I have read my own work aloud many times. One of the reasons I got into poetry was because I enjoyed performing and I didn't like acting. My poems are often funny, though not really joky.Glenn Ingersollhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10674475308395975995noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-57149564302029617342008-03-12T12:23:00.000+00:002008-03-12T12:23:00.000+00:00Thanks for the feedback, Gabe. I think part of the...Thanks for the feedback, Gabe. I think part of the problem with John Cooper Clarke, especially with 'Chicken Town' is that the audience probably know it as well as he does they're heard it so many times. I listened to a lot of the recordings on-line and some of them were truly awful and not as I remember him. He's always delivered his party pieces at a fair rate of knots but I suspect at this stage in his career he's just going through the motions; he must really hate performing 'Chicken Town' after 30 years. I did enjoy 'I Mustn't Go Down to the Sea Again' because a) it was new to me and b) the performance wasn't quite so frenetic. He really was very well-known in the UK in his heyday. He even did a TV advert for Kellogs!Jim Murdochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12786388638146471193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-77439572533514670692008-03-12T11:58:00.000+00:002008-03-12T11:58:00.000+00:00Over the years I have attended quite a number of '...Over the years I have attended quite a number of 'name' and obscure poets reading. At times I have driven considerable distance... in particular during a blizzard to attend an evening with Robert Bly. I have also done performance many times, though I no longer do this. I got tired of trying to resonate off the bar tender.<BR/><BR/>There are a whole lot of different ways for poetry to be delivered, on the page or in performance. I do not feel that there is any qualitative difference between one and another any more than I do not feel that there is a qualitative difference between one form or performance of music. I may at any one time prefer certain forms and delivery, but in general it seems to me a multiplicity of variation to celebrate.<BR/><BR/>I do admit that there are more outstanding examples in any form and delivery, with poetry, as with music. Some folks just go a whole lot further on their tangent than others.<BR/><BR/>A whole lot about poetry performance has to do with the setting and the media of delivery. <BR/><BR/>I used to enjoy going out and standing on a street corner and shouting poetry. I admire street screamers. That is a different kind of delivery that one learns than say in a nice room with comfortable chairs, a bottle of plum wine and a fire in the fireplace with a group of friends in attendance.<BR/><BR/>I have also staged a number of poetry readings over the years, that has always been an interesting adventure. The Feminist poets drove a long way in a snow storm (for whatever reason I remember the snowy ones best?) and were pissed at me for being a male. The Prison Poets were pissed at me for being free and exploiting them. Nobody every made any money at this promoting and it was worse, though also much more exciting, than being a literary magazine publisher. <BR/><BR/>Before the show there is always the anxiousness to see how many people one has been able to attract to witness a gaggle of self-interested poets belch off their work.<BR/><BR/>My most provocative reading was to an audience of 200. It was staged off a hay wagon and we had all of us been into party for the entire day and it was a performance piece, with musician collaborators to provide back-up (acoustic) with a sound system. The piece was done on a warm summer evening with the sound of my voice echoed through the sound system off the surrounding hills. That was the one and only performance of that piece. We had spent weeks rehearsing.<BR/><BR/>One reason I don't read is that I have found people have enough trouble, as I get older, relating to my poetry on the page and it leads me to consider that they won't get it any better when I read it aloud.<BR/><BR/>Now, if you all come over to visit and you bring your poems I will be willing to share in the voice. <BR/><BR/>My reaction to John Cooper Clarke's <I>Evidently Chicken Town</I> is that I cannot understand WTF he is saying so for me it comes out as an equivalent to a riddim like a Tibetan chant, only shorter. From the pure musicality of the performance it is ok, not by my estimate outstanding, but ok. I read the words on the page, I laugh and move on to something else.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15887517793752604788noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-57055776223885789682008-03-12T02:50:00.000+00:002008-03-12T02:50:00.000+00:00I was lucky ernough to see John Cooper Clark perfo...I was lucky ernough to see John Cooper Clark perform at The Big Day Out in Adleaide last year, and despite his low ranking on the bill, was blown away. He's got the staggering energy and drive of the most virulent of punk rockers, but has enough heart to sway any listener to pause and reflect- a fantastic reccomendation to any poets out there = )Akemi Itohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07343730872343956629noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-4039961997507385862008-03-11T15:29:00.000+00:002008-03-11T15:29:00.000+00:00Nice to have you back, Dave. You're mistaken I'm a...Nice to have you back, Dave. You're mistaken I'm afraid I've never been to a performance poetry event – I've only ever seen John Cooper Clarke on TV – but I can see why you might enjoy hearing children read, as long as they were young enough to still be endearing.Jim Murdochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12786388638146471193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-82175258208032665122008-03-11T14:41:00.000+00:002008-03-11T14:41:00.000+00:00Hi Jim,Good to be back - at last!Your post brought...Hi Jim,<BR/>Good to be back - at last!<BR/>Your post brought back a few memories. Unlike you, I have never been to a performance poetry event, but I did (like you) get drawn into a couple of poetry readings., like you, because I had entered a local competition, once on the spur of the moment and then because I was asked. I can't say I enjoyed reading my work. I have this conviction that poems should never be read by the author or by an actor. What I did enjoy, though, was the children's section and hearing them read their contributions. They had a freshness and an originality that the others mostly did not have.Dave Kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08430484174826768488noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-7821356037938837382008-03-10T19:44:00.000+00:002008-03-10T19:44:00.000+00:00This is the point I was making about John Cooper C...This is the point I was making about John Cooper Clarke's performances compared to that by the actor Christopher Eccleston and I <I>so</I> wished I could have added a link showing him in <I>Strumpet</I> because the performance is so powerful. It is a combination of a great poem – and love it or loathe it, 'Definitely Chicken Town' gets its message across – and a great performance. It's interesting to hear poets read their work – I was listening to Sylvia Plath only a few days ago – but that is all it is. I'll be honest I <I>like</I> the way Larkin reads. If anyone was going to read his work then his kind of drab, rainy-day voice is perfect but I regard him as very much an exception. <BR/><BR/>I also hate my own voice, Conda. I'm used to public speaking and have no fear of it but I grue when I hear my voice recorded. It is nothing like the rich baritone I hear in my head and THAT is the voice I hear when I hear my poems something I am incapable of reproducing. There is also the fact that, once my poems are out in the world, then they become collaborations between me and their readers and so if other people choose to read them out loud then who am I to kick up a fuss?Jim Murdochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12786388638146471193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-74703588437061908692008-03-10T18:35:00.000+00:002008-03-10T18:35:00.000+00:00Jim, this post resonated with me for a couple of r...Jim, this post resonated with me for a couple of reasons. First, I have Caedmon's recordings of famous poets (W.H.Auden, W.B.Yeats, Robert Graves, others) reading their own poetry. They all suck. It's interesting to hear their different emphasis on phrases and words but--they all suck. The poems sound horrible.<BR/><BR/>Second, I've had the opportunity to read my short stories aloud on more than one occasion. I've done some voice acting, but still there's something about reading my own words--I'm sure I sucked too.Conda Douglashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12972790965426924941noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-23685019816330538132008-03-10T15:40:00.000+00:002008-03-10T15:40:00.000+00:00Thanks for the feedback, Lydia. It's an interestin...Thanks for the feedback, Lydia. It's an interesting point you make. I had never really considered that the humour could surround the poems but it also bothers me a little that social poetry – if I can call it that – somehow feels it needs humour to make it more palatable. I'm not saying that it can't be but there should be room for both. Some people will go and see <I>The Pirates of Penzance</I> for a night out whereas others would prefer Schoenberg's <I>Moses und Aron</I>; there's room in this world for both. It's not that I think poetry should be taken more seriously, I just don't think that it should be taken too lightly.Jim Murdochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12786388638146471193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6327348657265652781.post-47588096222296486312008-03-10T12:19:00.000+00:002008-03-10T12:19:00.000+00:00We used to make such brutal fun of the poets in gr...We used to make such brutal fun of the poets in graduate school (we were, of course, fiction writers and therefore QUITE different). They all did that upspeak kind of thing where the voice? goes up? at the end? And there were a lot of crows doing the job of symbolizing our depraved culture. <BR/><BR/>I think your answer is in your post already: Humor is key, but it can come before or after, not just during the poem. You should have no problem with that. The only thing that makes a poetry reading awful is when someone takes it so bloody seriously.Lydia Netzerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11448861273955788158noreply@blogger.com